Strategy (Obsidian Notes) - Revision history

Devonnn: /* Debate pervertry */ add more debate pedophile tactics

2024-06-26T03:05:00Z

Debate pervertry: add more debate pedophile tactics

← Older revision		Revision as of 03:05, 26 June 2024
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	=== "I don't even care" ===		=== "I don't even care" ===

			=== "The Webster Warrior" or "The Oxford Offensive" ===
			If you are having a debate around a topic that requires a certain level of complex contextual understanding, but when confronted and not being able to provide satisfactory justifications for your arguments, you appeal to a dictionary definition.

			=== Analogy Allergy ===
			When a person refuses to engage with a hypothetical, not because they've demonstrated the hypothetical is inapplicable to the current disagreement, but because the hypothetical is "wacky" or "crazy."
			# [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YqIaiQ-aK_s&ab_channel=TheCrucible Andrew Wilson vs Dave Smith: Is Libertarianism better than Christian Populism?]

	== Interview strategy ==		== Interview strategy ==

Devonnn: /* Rhetorical strategies */ updated

2024-05-30T05:46:01Z

Rhetorical strategies: updated

← Older revision		Revision as of 05:46, 30 May 2024
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	I consider this a subtle use of the noncentral fallacy, which I know you hate.		I consider this a subtle use of the noncentral fallacy, which I know you hate.
			# When taking notes during a debate, and responding to everything the other person, the other person rarely responds to all of my points. Instead of wiping my entire board, I should remind the person (and the audience) that they failed to respond to the points I've made.
			# Need to call out people more who live in stories or anecdotes or unrelated examples/data.
			# Restate when a person doesn't answer a question and move on.
			#* Restate what the other person said and ask them if that was an answer to your question.

	[[Category:Obsidian Notes]]		[[Category:Obsidian Notes]]

Devonnn: /* Tragedy of the commons sense */ added "I don't even care"

2024-05-30T05:44:58Z

Tragedy of the commons sense: added "I don't even care"

← Older revision		Revision as of 05:44, 30 May 2024
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	=== Tragedy of the commons sense ===		=== Tragedy of the commons sense ===
	Basically any time someone invokes common sense because they're unable to explain or justify their position in any other way.		Basically any time someone invokes common sense because they're unable to explain or justify their position in any other way.

			=== "I don't even care" ===

	== Interview strategy ==		== Interview strategy ==

Devonnn: category obsidian notes

2024-05-20T00:37:00Z

category obsidian notes

← Older revision		Revision as of 00:37, 20 May 2024
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	I consider this a subtle use of the noncentral fallacy, which I know you hate.		I consider this a subtle use of the noncentral fallacy, which I know you hate.
			[[Category:Obsidian Notes]]

Devonnn: /* Death by a thousand anecdotes */ Tragedy of the commons sense

2024-05-19T22:55:42Z

Death by a thousand anecdotes: Tragedy of the commons sense

← Older revision		Revision as of 22:55, 19 May 2024
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	=== Death by a thousand anecdotes ===		=== Death by a thousand anecdotes ===
	When someone is incapable of pushing back factually against a heavily data-driven argument and instead relies upon personal (or popular) anecdotes, or unrelated data to make their point.		When someone is incapable of pushing back factually against a heavily data-driven argument and instead relies upon personal (or popular) anecdotes, or unrelated data to make their point.

			=== Tragedy of the commons sense ===
			Basically any time someone invokes common sense because they're unable to explain or justify their position in any other way.

	== Interview strategy ==		== Interview strategy ==

Devonnn: /* You're being so weird/obsessed! */ added death by a thousand anecdotes

2024-05-19T22:27:22Z

You're being so weird/obsessed!: added death by a thousand anecdotes

← Older revision		Revision as of 22:27, 19 May 2024
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	=== You're being so weird/obsessed! ===		=== You're being so weird/obsessed! ===
	When someone does something that you do exactly and then you accuse them of being weird when they do it, e.g. making clips/compilations of what the other person does and then the other community creates something in response.		When someone does something that you do exactly and then you accuse them of being weird when they do it, e.g. making clips/compilations of what the other person does and then the other community creates something in response.

			=== Death by a thousand anecdotes ===
			When someone is incapable of pushing back factually against a heavily data-driven argument and instead relies upon personal (or popular) anecdotes, or unrelated data to make their point.

	== Interview strategy ==		== Interview strategy ==

Devonnn: /* When you intentionally say the name of your interlocutor incorrectly. */ finkelstein link

2024-05-19T14:36:42Z

When you intentionally say the name of your interlocutor incorrectly.: finkelstein link

← Older revision		Revision as of 14:36, 19 May 2024
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	=== When you intentionally say the name of your interlocutor incorrectly. ===		=== When you intentionally say the name of your interlocutor incorrectly. ===
			{{disambiguation\|See also: [[Norman Finkelstein#Debate Memes\|Norman Finkelstein]]}}

	=== [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fallacy_of_the_single_cause Fallacy of the Single Cause] ===		=== [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fallacy_of_the_single_cause Fallacy of the Single Cause] ===

Devonnn: fix internal links

2024-05-19T14:33:20Z

fix internal links

Devonnn: debate pervertry

2024-05-19T14:30:44Z

debate pervertry

Show changes

Devonnn: Create page

2024-05-19T13:39:21Z

Create page

New page

{{Obsidian Disclaimer}}
== People's beliefs ==
=== Aesthetic vs function ===
=== Constellations of beliefs ===
=== Humans are not truth-seeking machines ===
=== Normative confusion with applied positions ===
=== Skeptics rarely are ===
=== Social incentives dictate beliefs ===
== Countering irrational beliefs ==
== Debate pervertry ==
== Interview strategy ==
== Perception ==
== Rhetorical strategies ==

← Older revision		Revision as of 14:33, 19 May 2024
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	Some examples of this might be:		Some examples of this might be:

	# “Non-partisanship,” or putting oneself above [[~~#Strategy_(Obsidian Notes)~~#Social incentives dictate beliefs\| pressure to believe everything a certain political group believes]]. Very rarely does the “non-partisan” individual have a way of independently generating unique, consistent and coherent thoughts, but rather they find a way to criticize unimportant things that appear to be part of their [[~~#Strategy_(Obsidian Notes)~~#Constellation_of_beliefs\| political in-group]] while still aligning 100% with every important, core belief. A great example of this is being highly critical of Donald Trump’s promiscuity or fiscal habits while being in lock-step with everything more integral to Donald Trump’s associated beliefs, such as his historically divisive rhetoric, his claims of mass voter fraud, or his claims that the entire political and corporate world are a “swamp” waiting for him to drain them.		# “Non-partisanship,” or putting oneself above [[#Social incentives dictate beliefs\| pressure to believe everything a certain political group believes]]. Very rarely does the “non-partisan” individual have a way of independently generating unique, consistent and coherent thoughts, but rather they find a way to criticize unimportant things that appear to be part of their [[#Constellation_of_beliefs\| political in-group]] while still aligning 100% with every important, core belief. A great example of this is being highly critical of Donald Trump’s promiscuity or fiscal habits while being in lock-step with everything more integral to Donald Trump’s associated beliefs, such as his historically divisive rhetoric, his claims of mass voter fraud, or his claims that the entire political and corporate world are a “swamp” waiting for him to drain them.
	# “Rationality,” or pretending to be someone possessing a high level of “reason” or critical analysis. Almost never does a person claiming they are “rational” or “truth-seeking” does the person actually exhibit any qualities fundamental to those people, rather they tend to align almost entirely with certain other groups of people and they simply wield this “rationality” against someone else that belongs to the “wrong” side.		# “Rationality,” or pretending to be someone possessing a high level of “reason” or critical analysis. Almost never does a person claiming they are “rational” or “truth-seeking” does the person actually exhibit any qualities fundamental to those people, rather they tend to align almost entirely with certain other groups of people and they simply wield this “rationality” against someone else that belongs to the “wrong” side.
	# [[~~#Strategy_(Obsidian Notes)~~#Skeptics rarely are\| “Skepticism” is never applied evenly to anything]]. People are almost never skeptical from a place of rational criticism, but rather because the skepticism is required to maintain their cognitive consonance.		# [[#Skeptics rarely are\| “Skepticism” is never applied evenly to anything]]. People are almost never skeptical from a place of rational criticism, but rather because the skepticism is required to maintain their cognitive consonance.
	# “Uncomfortable truths” are almost always incredibly comfortable. They wear the guise of discomfort in order to smuggle in some incredibly comfortable thing. Great examples of this might be telling people the “uncomfortable truth” that some huge system is against them, e.g. the FDA or WHO or IMF, but this is actually incredibly comfortable to most people because it helps them organize the world and provides an external entity by which you can blame significant, societal problems on. Almost none of these “uncomfortable truths” require you to change your mind or your actions in a way that you wouldn’t already want to, but instead serve to motivate you to moving down a path you already find highly desirable.		# “Uncomfortable truths” are almost always incredibly comfortable. They wear the guise of discomfort in order to smuggle in some incredibly comfortable thing. Great examples of this might be telling people the “uncomfortable truth” that some huge system is against them, e.g. the FDA or WHO or IMF, but this is actually incredibly comfortable to most people because it helps them organize the world and provides an external entity by which you can blame significant, societal problems on. Almost none of these “uncomfortable truths” require you to change your mind or your actions in a way that you wouldn’t already want to, but instead serve to motivate you to moving down a path you already find highly desirable.

	=== Constellation of beliefs ===		=== Constellation of beliefs ===
	Rather than starting from some epistemically humble foundation and individually constructing beliefs, people inherit constellations of beliefs from the social groups they find themselves in, often due to [[~~#Strategy_(Obsidian Notes)~~#Social incentives dictate beliefs\| social pressures]] that push them towards these belief systems. These constellations of beliefs will share some similar, hollow chains of logic, but they are ultimately absorbed at the “applied” level for most people and often have little to no thought put into them before they’re accepted as a person’s own beliefs. These beliefs are always somewhat abstract as well, meaning there is no immediate corrective mechanism that exists in the real world to counter them, as they always make claims that are either just out of our ability to perceive them or will come at some point in the future (though they rarely, if ever, manifest).		Rather than starting from some epistemically humble foundation and individually constructing beliefs, people inherit constellations of beliefs from the social groups they find themselves in, often due to [[#Social incentives dictate beliefs\| social pressures]] that push them towards these belief systems. These constellations of beliefs will share some similar, hollow chains of logic, but they are ultimately absorbed at the “applied” level for most people and often have little to no thought put into them before they’re accepted as a person’s own beliefs. These beliefs are always somewhat abstract as well, meaning there is no immediate corrective mechanism that exists in the real world to counter them, as they always make claims that are either just out of our ability to perceive them or will come at some point in the future (though they rarely, if ever, manifest).

	Here is an example from 2024:		Here is an example from 2024:
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	Humans treat truth as instrumental, meaning it is a tool to be utilized to further someone's personal happiness. When the tool is no longer serving that purpose, it will be abandoned in favor of another tool. In certain domains, especially relating to science, engineering and medicine, “truth” most likely needs to adhere pretty closely to reality for the truth to yield any certain of tangible benefit. It’s not very beneficial for one to believe drinking mercury will cure their disease nor pouring gasoline onto a candle will make it burn brighter, so these beliefs are quickly and immediately dispelled in favor of something that more accurately approaches what is actually true.		Humans treat truth as instrumental, meaning it is a tool to be utilized to further someone's personal happiness. When the tool is no longer serving that purpose, it will be abandoned in favor of another tool. In certain domains, especially relating to science, engineering and medicine, “truth” most likely needs to adhere pretty closely to reality for the truth to yield any certain of tangible benefit. It’s not very beneficial for one to believe drinking mercury will cure their disease nor pouring gasoline onto a candle will make it burn brighter, so these beliefs are quickly and immediately dispelled in favor of something that more accurately approaches what is actually true.

	It’s important to recognize this because humans who believe their senses naturally and intuitively lead them to “truthful” things rather than “pleasurable” things are likely to confuse the two when there is [[~~#Strategy_(Obsidian Notes)~~#Social incentives dictate beliefs\| incentive]] to believe the truth about a thing. Without any immediate mechanisms to align “truth” with “utility’, people can wildly diverge from truthful things in fantastic ways that lead to catastrophic consequences down the road. Examples of things might be things like vaccine skepticism, climate change denialism, or the mistrust of our voting process. Since these beliefs inherited from our social groups lack any immediately corrective mechanisms, it’s easy for them to fester and manifest in long term negative ways.		It’s important to recognize this because humans who believe their senses naturally and intuitively lead them to “truthful” things rather than “pleasurable” things are likely to confuse the two when there is [[#Social incentives dictate beliefs\| incentive]] to believe the truth about a thing. Without any immediate mechanisms to align “truth” with “utility’, people can wildly diverge from truthful things in fantastic ways that lead to catastrophic consequences down the road. Examples of things might be things like vaccine skepticism, climate change denialism, or the mistrust of our voting process. Since these beliefs inherited from our social groups lack any immediately corrective mechanisms, it’s easy for them to fester and manifest in long term negative ways.

	=== Normative confusion with applied positions ===		=== Normative confusion with applied positions ===
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	=== Skeptics rarely are ===		=== Skeptics rarely are ===
	When individuals become skeptical of a particular thing, it’s not usually because it is failing to live up to some [[~~#Strategy_(Obsidian Notes)~~#Social incentives dictate beliefs\| internal rational rubric]], it’s usually because it’s failing to satisfy some other [[~~#Strategy_(Obsidian Notes)~~#Social incentives dictate beliefs\| personal desire]] or it’s causing some amount of [[~~#Strategy_(Obsidian Notes)~~#Resolving cognitive dissonance\| cognitive dissonance]].		When individuals become skeptical of a particular thing, it’s not usually because it is failing to live up to some [[#Social incentives dictate beliefs\| internal rational rubric]], it’s usually because it’s failing to satisfy some other [[#Social incentives dictate beliefs\| personal desire]] or it’s causing some amount of [[#Resolving cognitive dissonance\| cognitive dissonance]].

	Evidence can be found of this in multiple ways.		Evidence can be found of this in multiple ways.
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	=== Social incentives dictate beliefs ===		=== Social incentives dictate beliefs ===
	People rarely apply a consistent, rational formulation for whatever their beliefs are. This is not because people are stupid or lack the ability to do so, but rather because there is little to no incentive for doing so. [[~~#Strategy_(Obsidian Notes)~~#Truth is instrumental\| Truth is simply a means to enrich our lives]]. For the majority of political issues, it is easier to change the truth than it is to change one’s mind. There is great incentive in believing in particular untrue things, especially when there is little practical consequences for having an incorrect understanding of an issue.		People rarely apply a consistent, rational formulation for whatever their beliefs are. This is not because people are stupid or lack the ability to do so, but rather because there is little to no incentive for doing so. [[#Truth is instrumental\| Truth is simply a means to enrich our lives]]. For the majority of political issues, it is easier to change the truth than it is to change one’s mind. There is great incentive in believing in particular untrue things, especially when there is little practical consequences for having an incorrect understanding of an issue.

	Examples of certain social pressures:		Examples of certain social pressures:
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	** Assuming you’re not someone who’s job relies on getting the facts correct, like a prosecutor, lawyer, journalist or someone working in the system, there is no reward for being factually correct about anything related to Rittenhouse.		** Assuming you’re not someone who’s job relies on getting the facts correct, like a prosecutor, lawyer, journalist or someone working in the system, there is no reward for being factually correct about anything related to Rittenhouse.
	* Punishment for having factually accurate beliefs:		* Punishment for having factually accurate beliefs:
	** If you are in any social circles that a staunchly pro-BLM, expressing certain factual accuracies about the events of that night might lead to you being ostracized from your groups, or [[~~#Strategy_(Obsidian Notes)~~#Constellation of beliefs\| webbed]] as a white supremacist.		** If you are in any social circles that a staunchly pro-BLM, expressing certain factual accuracies about the events of that night might lead to you being ostracized from your groups, or [[#Constellation of beliefs\| webbed]] as a white supremacist.
	* Rewards for having factually inaccurate beliefs:		* Rewards for having factually inaccurate beliefs:
	** Depending on what you get wrong, people might celebrate you for having incorrect beliefs, especially if you’re over-stating the wrong doings of Rittenhouse of under-stating the actions of the assailants. Common examples of wrong beliefs being rewarded: “Rittenhouse was spraying his magazine into the crowd!” or “The person chasing Rittenhouse only threw a plastic bag, how scary!”		** Depending on what you get wrong, people might celebrate you for having incorrect beliefs, especially if you’re over-stating the wrong doings of Rittenhouse of under-stating the actions of the assailants. Common examples of wrong beliefs being rewarded: “Rittenhouse was spraying his magazine into the crowd!” or “The person chasing Rittenhouse only threw a plastic bag, how scary!”