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Dehumanization & Edgy Jokes - Destiny Discusses ft. Pxie, intro blub, additional timestamps.
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{{#ev:youtube|https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NQ272vsoaXw|300px|right| '''"Dehumanization & Edgy Jokes - Destiny Discusses ft. Pxie'''}}
{{#ev:youtube|https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NQ272vsoaXw|300px|right| '''"Dehumanization & Edgy Jokes - Destiny Discusses ft. Pxie'''}}


On October 25, 2019, Pxie and Destiny discussed the implications of edgy humor(specifically those containing racial slurs), and it's role in causing individuals to feel dehumanized. This conversation was brought on following the pair's difficulties in having a meaningful engagement on the same topic during a [https://wiki.destiny.gg/view/%22I%27ve_never_been_more_gaslit_in_my_entire_life...%22_-_Destiny_Debate_ft._Hasanabi,_TheSerfsTV,_%26_More Mindwaves debate panel].  
On October 25, 2019, Pxie and Destiny discussed the implications of edgy humor(specifically those containing racial slurs), and it's role in causing individuals to feel dehumanized. This conversation was brought on following the duo's difficulties in having a meaningful engagement on the same topic during a [https://wiki.destiny.gg/view/%22I%27ve_never_been_more_gaslit_in_my_entire_life...%22_-_Destiny_Debate_ft._Hasanabi,_TheSerfsTV,_%26_More Mindwaves debate panel].  


During the conversation, Pxie asserts that society(even within an {{wiki|egoist}} framework) should strive to eliminate oppression and dehumanization, as such systems ultimately work to harm all individuals within society. She extends this reasoning to argue against the private use of racial slurs or edgy language, asserting that such behavior can perpetuate the harmful subconscious biases inherent in all individuals, and cause those minorities whom the slurs are directed at to feel "otherized". In response, Destiny acknowledges that racial humor or edgy language can, at times, reinforce subconscious biases, especially when espoused by individuals without a formal understanding of their harmful nature.  However, he maintains that individuals who are fully aware of the harm such language can cause may be able to engage with it without falling victim to those subconscious pitfalls.
During the conversation, Pxie asserts that society(even within an {{wiki|egoist}} framework) should strive to eliminate oppression and dehumanization, as such systems ultimately work to harm all individuals within society. She extends this reasoning to argue against the private use of racial slurs or edgy language, asserting that such behavior can perpetuate the harmful subconscious biases inherent in all individuals, and cause those minorities whom the slurs are directed at to feel "otherized". In response, Destiny acknowledges that racial humor or edgy language can, at times, reinforce subconscious biases, especially when espoused by individuals without a formal understanding of their harmful nature.  However, he maintains that individuals who are fully aware of the harm such language can cause may be able to engage with it without falling victim to those subconscious pitfalls.
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* '''[https://youtu.be/NQ272vsoaXw?t=497 8:17]''' Pxie provides her rebuttal to Destiny's argument: She asserts that the continuation of such edgy-jokes/racial humour, even in private, can lend credence to the subconscious biases inherent in all individuals.  
* '''[https://youtu.be/NQ272vsoaXw?t=497 8:17]''' Pxie provides her rebuttal to Destiny's argument: She asserts that the continuation of such edgy-jokes/racial humour, even in private, can lend credence to the subconscious biases inherent in all individuals.  
* '''[https://youtu.be/NQ272vsoaXw?t=540 9:00]''' Destiny offers his perspective: Engaging in humour containing racial elements may reinforce subconscious biases present in some individuals, or even create those biases in some cases. He provides the example of somebody spending time on 4chan eventually becoming racist following their engagement with several jokes directed towards black people. Destiny posits that it is possible for and individual to reach a "level of cognition" relevant to this type of humour, where engagement with the subject matter could be done without giving rise to any implicit biases. Destiny provides himself as an example, explaining that he is very aware of the background as to why certain slurs are harmful, and therefore anyone with such knowledge would be able to engage in racial humour without being subconsciously influenced.  
* '''[https://youtu.be/NQ272vsoaXw?t=540 9:00]''' Destiny offers his perspective: Engaging in humour containing racial elements may reinforce subconscious biases present in some individuals, or even create those biases in some cases. He provides the example of somebody spending time on 4chan eventually becoming racist following their engagement with several jokes directed towards black people. Destiny posits that it is possible for and individual to reach a "level of cognition" relevant to this type of humour, where engagement with the subject matter could be done without giving rise to any implicit biases. Destiny provides himself as an example, explaining that he is very aware of the background as to why certain slurs are harmful, and therefore anyone with such knowledge would be able to engage in racial humour without being subconsciously influenced.  
* [https://youtu.be/NQ272vsoaXw?t=629 10:29] Pxie argues Destiny's position is more idealistic than pragmatic, and argues nobody is immune to these subconscious biases. Pxie argues the only way one would be able to determine if they were immune to these biases is if they were to take a series of scientifically valid subconscious testings. She posits even an individual who frequently takes part in pro-minority rallies has the propensity to fall victim to their subconscious bias. 
* [https://youtu.be/NQ272vsoaXw?t=729 12:09] Destiny argues a "harm" is committed when one loses access to certain forms of humour. Destiny defines "harm" as somebody losing access to a pleasurable thing.
* [https://youtu.be/NQ272vsoaXw?t=797 13:17] Destiny posits a hypothetical to Pxie: Two individuals are identical in all measurable societal behaviors—how they treat minorities, how they vote, and how they interact with others—but differ internally. However, one person harbors implicit biases but is self-aware enough to check and manage them, while the other does not have these biases at all. Are these people significantly different? Pxie answers in the affirmative, arguing there is a difference.
* [https://youtu.be/NQ272vsoaXw?t=837 13:57] Pxie argues that Destiny's hypothetical being dependent on the ability for an individual to "check" their subconscious biases makes his hypothetical unrealistic and impractical. Destiny counters that one could be able to address their subconscious biases through "checking" themselves, and explains the Cognitive Behavior Therapy model to Pxie:Thoughts can happen without our control, but we can choose how we respond to those facts.
* [https://youtu.be/NQ272vsoaXw?t=905 15:05] Pxie argues that while Destiny may be able to check his subconscious bias when making such jokes, the individuals who hear the jokes may not be able to do so. Destiny disagrees, and argues that individuals(especially friends) can generally have a good understanding of what the thoughts are of the people around them. Destiny argues that if one can trust a doctor not to perform sexual acts on them when they're unconscious for surgery, one should be able to trust certain individuals in their friend group to not be racists.
* [https://youtu.be/NQ272vsoaXw?t=1039 17:19] While Pxie agrees with Destiny's general position, she argues that one would have to take a big gamble when telling edgy jokes pertaining to marginalized/oppressed groups. She further asserts that the small loss of humour one would feel by not telling these jokes is marginal compared to the reinforcement of these oppressive structures towards minorities.
* [https://youtu.be/NQ272vsoaXw?t=1096 18:16] Destiny responds, arguing that while he understands Pxie's perspective the biggest strength of his own perspective is that he is able to draw a line to determine "what is responsible"(i.e. private setting with individuals once can trust to not be racist).
* [https://youtu.be/NQ272vsoaXw?t=1122 18:42] Destiny argues that the logical conclusion to Pxie's perspective may do more harm than good. He explains that by her logic, even using a slur in "okay" contexts, the word's utterance would still contribute to the oppression of minorities. He argues by this logic, black people should never be allowed to say the n-word themselves, even in rap songs.
|}
|}


Revision as of 15:09, 10 December 2024

Pxie
Personal Information
StatusActive
OccupationLivestreamer
Country of OriginUSA
Online Information
Xpxielovee
Instagrampxielove
YouTube@Pxielove_
DGG Links

Pxie is a Puerto Rican-American livestreamer and political commentator. She first appeared on stream with Destiny during a Mindwaves debate panel to discuss the justifiability of edgy language in private. Since that debate, Pxie has occasionally appeared on Destiny's stream to discuss hot-button political/social issues, and participate in informal conversations with Destiny regarding on-stream events.

Pxie was nominated for the 2023 Destiny Award for Buddy of the Year, and the 2019 Destiny Award for Ally of the Year.

Political Advocacy

Although Pxie's on-stream interactions and debates with Destiny have been infrequent as of late, she has played an active role in political advocacy initiatives by DGG. This role has included participating in DGG canvassing campaigns, and assisting in on-stream election coverage with Destiny.[1][2][3]

Notable On Stream Appearances with Destiny

Edgy language in private debate

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"I've never been more gaslit in my entire life..." - Destiny Debate ft. Hasanabi, TheSerfsTV, & More
Main Article: "I've never been more gaslit in my entire life..." - Destiny Debate ft. Hasanabi, TheSerfsTV, & More

On October 22, 2019 Pxie participated in a political panel hosted by MindWaves. The panel featured Destiny, Hasan Piker, TheSerfsTV (AKA Lance), Ahrelevant, Bastiat, Kormantine and Cole James Cash.[4][5] Four topics were discussed during the panel, among those topics included a recent Canadian Election, usage of the n-word in private, the 2020 Democratic primary, Wikipedia and Mark Zuckerberg's Wikipedia secret meetings with Conservatives. The second topic, usage of the n-word in private, took up the bulk of the podcast's time and was by far the most tumultuous of the topics discussed.

Throughout the discussion, Pxie aligned more closely with those critical of Destiny's use of edgy language in private. Like others on the panel, she believed that Destiny's public acknowledgment of using such language in private undermined his stance on the harmful nature of "edgy words." That said, Pxie's neutral approach to engaging with Destiny's position, combined with her overall kinder demeanor, fostered a more constructive exchange of ideas compared to the more confrontational tone adopted by some of the other panelists.

Timestamps
  • 32:50 Pxie chimes in, and asks Destiny why he believes saying the n-word isn't racist. Destiny responds that as a public figure, he does not platform language that is harmful or further entrenches groups of people. Destiny continues, explaining that when in private and surrounded by individuals he is sure are not racist, there are "edgy" jokes involving racist terms he would be comfortable making(e.g. jokes from a George Carlin Skit, or a Boondocks episode). Pxie retorts that Destiny saying he states these jokes in private to the public, defeats the purpose of Destiny's stance on racist words. Destiny counters that he never repeats these "private jokes" to the public, as such, it would not nullify any public stance he takes on such terms.
  • 36:48 Pxie remarks that Destiny does not typically debate to change individuals minds, but is mainly trying to suey the audience. Destiny agrees.
  • 59:21 The panel attempts to give Pxie an opportunity to speak on the subject, and Kormantine states she should not speak on the manner because she's not black. Despite this, Pxie is given the opportunity to speak anyways. She states that Destiny admitting to saying the n-word in private defeats the purpose of his stance as it might normalize such racially charged language for individuals in his audience. She continues, arguing that individuals may not always know if someone is making a joke or not when saying the n-word.
  • 1:01:16 Destiny asks Pxie if she believes that rape-kinks are okay . She argues there's a clear difference, as individuals with a rape-fetish possess a mutually consenting fetish. Destiny counters that there is no true difference, as such edgy-jokes would only be shared with individuals he knows are not racist, in the same way individuals who share a "rape-kink" would know they're not actually engaging in rape.
  • 1:04:43 Following Cole's departure, and Mindwaves becoming irate, Kormantine asks Mindwaves how he can be upset at Cole for being made to debate such a sensitive topic. He continues, arguing it is toxic to have African Americans come into a conversation such as this and "prove themselves". Mindwaves retorts that Cole wanted to have this conversation, and therefore had no right to complain about the presence of the topic.
  • 1:06:32 Kormantine argues he would be able to have a discussion on this topic with Ahrelevant given that he is a fellow African American. He continues, asserting that white people are unable to be challenged by African Americans without getting frustrated. Destiny retorts that it is disgusting for Kormantine to "even pretend" that such grievances are even mildly related to the topic at hand.
  • 1:07:05 Ahrelevant points out that Kormantine has told Pxie to be quiet several times throughout the podcast. Kormantine reiterates that anybody who is not black should not voice their opinion on this subject.
  • 1:37:42 Pxie reiterates her belief that Destiny's stating his use of the word in private to the public is counterproductive. The two deliberate for some time.
  • 2:10:15 Pxie argues the n-word should probably not be used in private or public, nor say that it's used in private.
  • 2:53:56 Pxie addresses the race-play comparison. She admits to finding race-play to being "very sketch".
  • 3:02:51 Destiny points out that the two "pro-private language people"(himself and Ahrel) were the only ones who allowed Pxie to speak, meanwhile Kormantine, Cole, and Hasan took every opportunity to shut her down.

Dehumanization & Edgy Jokes - Destiny Discusses ft. Pxie WIP

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YouTube
"Dehumanization & Edgy Jokes - Destiny Discusses ft. Pxie

On October 25, 2019, Pxie and Destiny discussed the implications of edgy humor(specifically those containing racial slurs), and it's role in causing individuals to feel dehumanized. This conversation was brought on following the duo's difficulties in having a meaningful engagement on the same topic during a Mindwaves debate panel.

During the conversation, Pxie asserts that society(even within an egoist Wikipedia framework) should strive to eliminate oppression and dehumanization, as such systems ultimately work to harm all individuals within society. She extends this reasoning to argue against the private use of racial slurs or edgy language, asserting that such behavior can perpetuate the harmful subconscious biases inherent in all individuals, and cause those minorities whom the slurs are directed at to feel "otherized". In response, Destiny acknowledges that racial humor or edgy language can, at times, reinforce subconscious biases, especially when espoused by individuals without a formal understanding of their harmful nature. However, he maintains that individuals who are fully aware of the harm such language can cause may be able to engage with it without falling victim to those subconscious pitfalls.

Destiny and Pxie spend the greater part of an hour debating the topic, and ultimately conclude

Timestamps
  • 0:52 Pxie shares a work-in-process flowchart and write-up she created in preparation for this discussion.
  • 2:13 Despite not agreeing with egoism Wikipedia, Pxie states she intends to argue within it's framework. Pxie explains that as an egoist, one would want society to “get better” as it would benefit oneself. Pxie asserts that society should seek to eliminate unfair treatment of minorities and oppressed people, as such treatment would lead to marginalization, more crime, and less opportunity. Pxie concludes that all these things would hurt oneself in the long-run if left unaddressed, and therefore an egoist should seek to minimize harm towards these groups. Destiny responds that he agrees with this statement.
  • 3:21 Pxie explains that if one seeks to achieve a better society(as described in the prior bullet point), one should do whatever one can to combat these systems of oppression. Destiny agrees, but asserts that the cost of enacting such harm-reduction should not overtly harm oneself. He provides the example of white people killing themselves in the effort of reducing harm towards minorities. Pxie agrees.
  • 4:26 Pxie provides her definition of "dehumanization". She defines it as the process of depriving a person or a group of people from positive qualities and "otherizing" individuals. Pxie goes on to explain that a racial slur can contribute to this dehumanization, as it makes an individual feel excluded or demeaned on the basis of their race/ethnicity/nationality. Destiny cautiously agrees with this, explaining that this may be the case for the outset of a racial slur as an unintended consequence. Pxie agrees with Destiny.
  • 5:32 Pxie circles to her primary argument: Destiny should not use edgy-language containing racial slurs in private.
  • 6:56 Pxie states what she believes to be Destiny's position: Using edgy-language/racial slurs for "shock value" is not actual racism if one is not a racist. Destiny agrees, and argues that one could theoretically use a slur in certain contexts without necessarily harming the group the slur is directed at.
  • 8:17 Pxie provides her rebuttal to Destiny's argument: She asserts that the continuation of such edgy-jokes/racial humour, even in private, can lend credence to the subconscious biases inherent in all individuals.
  • 9:00 Destiny offers his perspective: Engaging in humour containing racial elements may reinforce subconscious biases present in some individuals, or even create those biases in some cases. He provides the example of somebody spending time on 4chan eventually becoming racist following their engagement with several jokes directed towards black people. Destiny posits that it is possible for and individual to reach a "level of cognition" relevant to this type of humour, where engagement with the subject matter could be done without giving rise to any implicit biases. Destiny provides himself as an example, explaining that he is very aware of the background as to why certain slurs are harmful, and therefore anyone with such knowledge would be able to engage in racial humour without being subconsciously influenced.
  • 10:29 Pxie argues Destiny's position is more idealistic than pragmatic, and argues nobody is immune to these subconscious biases. Pxie argues the only way one would be able to determine if they were immune to these biases is if they were to take a series of scientifically valid subconscious testings. She posits even an individual who frequently takes part in pro-minority rallies has the propensity to fall victim to their subconscious bias.
  • 12:09 Destiny argues a "harm" is committed when one loses access to certain forms of humour. Destiny defines "harm" as somebody losing access to a pleasurable thing.
  • 13:17 Destiny posits a hypothetical to Pxie: Two individuals are identical in all measurable societal behaviors—how they treat minorities, how they vote, and how they interact with others—but differ internally. However, one person harbors implicit biases but is self-aware enough to check and manage them, while the other does not have these biases at all. Are these people significantly different? Pxie answers in the affirmative, arguing there is a difference.
  • 13:57 Pxie argues that Destiny's hypothetical being dependent on the ability for an individual to "check" their subconscious biases makes his hypothetical unrealistic and impractical. Destiny counters that one could be able to address their subconscious biases through "checking" themselves, and explains the Cognitive Behavior Therapy model to Pxie:Thoughts can happen without our control, but we can choose how we respond to those facts.
  • 15:05 Pxie argues that while Destiny may be able to check his subconscious bias when making such jokes, the individuals who hear the jokes may not be able to do so. Destiny disagrees, and argues that individuals(especially friends) can generally have a good understanding of what the thoughts are of the people around them. Destiny argues that if one can trust a doctor not to perform sexual acts on them when they're unconscious for surgery, one should be able to trust certain individuals in their friend group to not be racists.
  • 17:19 While Pxie agrees with Destiny's general position, she argues that one would have to take a big gamble when telling edgy jokes pertaining to marginalized/oppressed groups. She further asserts that the small loss of humour one would feel by not telling these jokes is marginal compared to the reinforcement of these oppressive structures towards minorities.
  • 18:16 Destiny responds, arguing that while he understands Pxie's perspective the biggest strength of his own perspective is that he is able to draw a line to determine "what is responsible"(i.e. private setting with individuals once can trust to not be racist).
  • 18:42 Destiny argues that the logical conclusion to Pxie's perspective may do more harm than good. He explains that by her logic, even using a slur in "okay" contexts, the word's utterance would still contribute to the oppression of minorities. He argues by this logic, black people should never be allowed to say the n-word themselves, even in rap songs.

Free Will vs Determinism - Destiny Debates Pxie WIP

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S9LnWQ3cQRg

"You're doing the Destiny thing..." - Post Bernie or Bust Discussion ft. Pxie WIP

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jP584WiH2X0

Pxie vs Mindwaves WIP

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x2RJi2bslOs&t=1425s

Destiny debates Pxie ft. Mindwaves WIP

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wd-LotbVN38

Dad Debates Feminist Daughter And Destiny WIP

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EURjZIiK1LI

Notable Debates

Pxie debates Playingwithfire WIP

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQaMnhwln68

Michael Knowles vs Pxie, Farha, and Jasmine WIP

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QGheQulIfao&t=81s

Whatever podcast debate with Andrew Wilson WIP

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=20RTvgQv0is

External Links

References

  1. ↑ Destiny. (2024, November 5). Trump Wins The Election LIVE REACTION AND AFTERMATH. Retrieved 2024, December 6, from https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NjG-NIRWnU0.
  2. ↑ PV Archive. (2024, February 11). Ohio Canvassing Newscast Couch Ft. @imreallyimportant & @DylanBurnsLIVE. Retrieved 2024, December 5, from https://youtu.be/5b_bpv7ZknU?t=927.
  3. ↑ Erin and Pxie in the Wild: Knocking on Doors in Ohio. (2022, November 3). Erin and Pxie in the Wild: Knocking on Doors in Ohio. Retrieved 2024, December 6, from https://www.reddit.com/r/Destiny/comments/zcxckx/erin_and_pxie_in_the_wild_knocking_on_doors_in/.
  4. ↑ Destiny. (2019, October 27). "I’ve never been more gaslit in my entire life...” - Destiny Debate ft. Hasanabi, TheSerfsTV, & More. Retrieved 2024, November 27, from https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hodq77NShaA.
  5. ↑ MindWavesTV. (2019, November 3). Big Brain Podcast Ep. 11 ft. Destiny, Hasan Piker, The Serfs, ActualJake, Cole James Cash & more. Retrieved 2024, November 27, from https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RHkH9TthrmU.
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